S04E11: ELIZABETH WETTLAUFER (CANADIAN SERIAL KILLER MINI-SERIES, PART III)

Stephanie: Coming up on this episode of Crime Family.

AJ: And this week Steph's gonna be telling us the case of Elizabeth Wettlaufer.

Katie: You'd think of, being a nurse, that their favorite thing would be helping people, taking care of them, keeping them healthy. But no, she liked to be in control during the night shift, which I think is sketchy.

Stephanie: Because this is a long-term care facility filled with elderly people nearing the end of their lives, and all of these people were seemingly passing away peacefully in their sleep, there was no reason to suspect foul play, and so no autopsies were done on the bodies.

But what's crazy is that this is not the first time that she's actually confessed. Elizabeth had previously confessed at least one of her murders to a pastor who just prayed over it and told her not to kill again.

AJ: To me, she just doesn't have that sort of serial killer vibe, which makes it even scarier cuz she's not your typical, she's not someone that you would typically see as a serial killer. Right?

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Welcome to part three of our four part miniseries on Canadian serial killers. This week, Steph's gonna be telling us the case of Elizabeth Wettlaufer.

Stephanie: So before I get started, has anybody heard of this case or watched any documentaries on it or read anything about it?

AJ: Yeah, I actually knew quite a bit. I actually suggested it for you for the miniseries . Yeah, I remember seeing it on the news when it happened cuz it's fairly recent and I was following it a little bit during that time. I also did watch an episode of some show, probably the Fifth Estate, knowing me cuz I get everything from there apparently. I think there was an episode of the Fifth Estate that I watched on this case. So I do know quite a bit.

Katie: Yeah, I know a little bit about it as well, so it's not brand new to me, but I still don't know all the details.

AJ: I think it might be new to a lot of people who are outside of Canada, because I know if you're in Canada, you probably have vaguely heard about it, but I don't think it was really widely known outside of Canada. I don't think so.

Katie: Yeah, and I think what's interesting about this case is it's not like a typical serial killer that you would think of, cause when you think of a serial killer, they're out hunting their victims, and this is, you know very different. So yeah. Let's get into it.

AJ: Yeah, and she's a female serial killer, which are not as common. So that's why I suggested it for you for the mini-series, cuz I thought it'd be interesting.

Stephanie: I heard something about it before you suggested it to me. I just didn't know the name, but I also watched a movie recently similar to this, but it was about a different case, but similar situation.

So, Elizabeth Wettlaufer was born in 1967 and grew up in Zora Township, a rural community near Woodstock, Ontario, Canada. Growing up, she was known as Beth and her maiden name was Parker. She grew up in a Baptist household and played the trombone in her high school band and also played field hockey. She was described by her friends on the Fifth Estate as shy and awkward and typically teased by other kids as she didn't quite fit in. She earned her bachelor's degree in religious education and counseling from the London Baptist Bible College and after graduating from Huron Park Secondary School in the mid 1980s, Elizabeth then studied nursing at college, and in 1995, she became a licensed registered nurse. Her life was marked by struggles with various mental illnesses and personal issues. These included depression, drug addiction, and sexual identity, but people that knew her and worked with her say she was a great worker and she loved to mentor other people and was passionate about her job. In 1997, Elizabeth married Daniel Wettlaufer, a long haul truck driver. They had no children and divorced after 11 years of marriage, at which point she was taking medication for borderline personality disorder, which is the inability to control one's emotions, as described by Professor Michael Brooks in Confessions of a Serial Killer. Most people that knew her say she was a normal person, worked hard to find a career, and they never really expected to find out what she did several years later. In 2007, Elizabeth was hired at Caressant Care, a long-term care home in Woodstock. It had been in business for over 30 years and housed about 160 elderly residents. She quickly started working night shift and was responsible for dispensing the medication to the patients. She also had access to a range of different drugs and medication. She primarily worked with those that were very ill or just couldn't look after themselves, and so they depended on her for comfort and support and relied on her to make those last years or months comfortable, especially since they were away from their families and had no other choice but to trust her with their wellbeing. Two months after she started working at Caressant Care, an 84 year old man named James Silcox was found dead in his bed, and James was a World War II vet, father of six and was described by his daughter, on the Fifth Estate, as a tough man. She says that he refused to use the walker that she had gotten for him. He refused to admit that he needed one, and the only reason he ended up at a long-term care facility was because he was suffering from dementia and had a stroke, and his wife could no longer look after him. His family was told that it was likely a heart attack that killed him, but no autopsy was conducted and the case was closed. He died on August 11th, 2007. On December 23rd, another elderly patient named Maurice Garnet died during the night shift as well. He was thought to have died peacefully from natural causes. After being divorced for two years, Elizabeth started online dating and met a woman named Sheila Andrews from Saskatchewan. Elizabeth traveled to Saskatoon to meet Sheila, and right away she told her how much she loved her and she was telling everyone at work that they were going to be together, but Sheila was a bit more hesitant. Sheila realized pretty quickly that it wasn't going to work out between the two of them. She told the Fifth Estate that Elizabeth was very pouty and would have little temper tantrums whenever she wasn't getting Sheila's full attention or enough affection from her, or if she didn't get her way most of the time. Basically Sheila just said that there was something off about Elizabeth and she also mentioned that what Elizabeth liked the most about her night shift as a nurse was having the power and being in charge. So you can see how what Sheila said, how the power went to her head and how she liked being in control and she didn't like when things were out of control or she didn't like when attention was not on her.

Katie: You'd think of being a nurse, their favorite thing would be helping people, taking care of them, keeping them healthy. But no, she liked to be in control during the night shift, which I think is sketchy.

AJ: I watched that Fifth Estate episode too, and also it's just interesting that they had spoken online, her and Sheila, for this long amount of time, and it took a very short amount of time upon actually meeting her where Sheila was like, "No, I'm out." How obvious must those red flags have been if she saw it right away?

Stephanie: Yeah. It's so hard to know how people are from talking online to talking in person. It's so hard to gauge what people are gonna be like.

AJ: But I'm assuming that they had talked on the phone before or FaceTime or something, so it's weird that it was so instant. Because the way Sheila's describing it, it's almost like it was the next day, or after one day of actually meeting her.

Katie: Yeah, but I think if you're talking to somebody, you're chatting, your full attention's on them. So she wouldn't have known how pouty and her little temper tantrums, that wouldn't have happened when they were talking cuz her full attention was on her. But then when you're together and you're actually having to do something else and you can see how they're acting when you're not with them or paying attention to them. So yeah, I feel like that could happen pretty quickly. Elizabeth's also posted poems online, and I just wanted to read an excerpt of one of them, because it just shows how dark her mind is. Here's part of one of them, for example, " She watches some life drain from the notch in his neck vein. As it soothingly pools, it smothers her pain. Sweet stiletto, so sharp craves another cut."

Stephanie: It seems like something dark is going on with Elizabeth, and that's how she expresses herself to the world.

AJ: I mean, the poem is Shakespeare, first of all. I'm just kidding. She was posting these on, I don't think it was Facebook, right? She was posting these on some blog website or something.

Katie: Yeah.

AJ: It's just super sketchy. In the Fifth Estate, when they go over the poem and considering the details of it, you'll get into later, it's pretty sketchy how she's literally laying it out pretty clear.

Stephanie: Yeah. So on her watch, more patients continue to die at Caressant Care. In October, 2011, 87 year old Gladys Millard, originally from Nova Scotia, passes away. Two weeks after Gladys, Helen Matheson dies on her 95th birthday, and then in November, Mary Zurawinski, a 96 year old resident, also passes away. Because this is a long-term care facility filled with elderly people nearing the end of their lives, and all of these people were seemingly passing away peacefully in their sleep, there was no reason to suspect foul play or anything suspicious, and so no autopsies were done on the bodies. What was concerning staff though, was Elizabeth's behavior. They were starting to suspect she was intoxicated while working and once, she was even found passed out on the basement floor while she was supposed to be on her shift. She eventually was fired in March of 2014 after seven years of working at Caressant Care. Management claimed it was because of a medication error that she was responsible for that could have harmed a patient, which happened multiple times in the past as well. Because of privacy laws, the information surrounding her firing and her firing in general were kept private, so I'm assuming that anyone that would be looking into her records for background information would not be aware of any of these situations.

AJ: Which seems bizarre to me. If she's gonna be getting hired as a nurse at another place, they don't have a right to access or to see the fact that she was fired for a medication error? I feel like that's something that they would want to know if they're gonna be hiring someone as a nurse. So to me that's crazy that, yes the privacy laws, I get it, but I feel like in that situation I feel like they should have access to that. I don't know the legality of it obviously, but to me it just seems bizarre.

Katie: I know. Why wouldn't you be open with that information? This nurse is fucking up people's medication more than once. That's something you should know about, I feel.

Stephanie: Yeah, when I was doing some research for this, when I came across this statement, I was thinking to myself, a lot of places, not just in the medical field, if you get fired from a job, if you go to another job, they have the right to look into your files about why you got fired. I feel that's just a known fact for any job that you really get, whether it's medical or whatever it may be. But I feel like you shouldn't be able to hide that stuff.

Katie: Honestly, though, I feel like I know that there's some sort of law in Canada, whereas if you have a reference and somebody calls that reference, they're not allowed to say bad things about you. They're not allowed to say you were fired for this and that like you were super bad. They're not allowed to have that information out there for some reason, even if, I don't know why , if you were putting that person on your resume as a reference, you'd use somebody that would say that stuff. But your old boss isn't allowed to list off shitty stuff that you've done, legally I guess. So I mean, it doesn't really make sense, but that's how it is.

AJ: Yeah. Like I guess they can just refuse to give a reference. I think if somebody calls them, they could just refuse to provide it, but they can't slander you, quote unquote or whatever. But I think there's also different degrees of it. I don't think a new employer should be able to go into someone's file and see the reason for their firing. I think that may be overstepping, but I think in the case of where you're actually harming other people, in that case it's like, "Well, yeah, she actually put a patient at risk for this medication error." I think that's something that maybe should be known, but I don't think an employer should be able to have all information. You know what I mean?

Stephanie: Or the fact that she was drunk at work too though.

Katie: Yeah.

Stephanie: That should be something that other facilities that she worked for, should know that she showed up drunk on a few occasions.

Katie: Yeah. But I mean, if you have a problem, if you're an alcoholic, employers aren't allowed to use that against you.

Stephanie: I guess.

Katie: Even if you were drunk at work, they can't be, "You have a problem." They can't really say that. But honestly, yeah I feel like especially in the medical field, if you're someone that's looking after people's lives, I feel like that info should be out there and it should be allowed to be out there on your record, cuz situations like this.

AJ: Couldn't that come back at the place that hires you? If they end up hiring someone who has a past history of all this, wouldn't that come back on them in some way? I mean, I don't know. Again, I don't know the legalities of it.

Katie: I guess it wouldn't because they didn't know. They didn't know your past, so they can't be held accountable.

AJ: I guess.

Katie: Right?

AJ: Yeah, it just seems very messy and I feel like in this situation it should be something that people should know.

Katie: Honestly, when I think about this, I don't know if you guys have watched this, Dr. Death. Did you guys watch any of those documentaries?

Stephanie: No, I haven't.

Katie: Okay. This guy legit, just butchered people during brain surgeries and back surgeries and you know, that was never on his record, and countless hospitals were able to...

AJ: But he wasn't even a doctor, was he? Was he a real doctor?

Katie: He was a real doctor.

AJ: Oh!

Katie: Yeah. But he was, for whatever reason, he was just really bad at it. He didn't know what he was doing, and he paralyzed people and killed some of them, and yet he was still able to work at multiple hospitals because nobody really put that on his record because it was too much paperwork.. So I mean, it's crazy.

Stephanie: Yeah. So like I said, there was no record of her being fired from Caressant Care. Shortly after she was fired from there, she started working at Meadow Park. One of the Meadow Park's residents, Arpad Horvath died in August of 2014, and then three weeks after that death Elizabeth realized that she needed help with her own struggles, and this is when she checked herself into a rehab center in Niagara, which made her jobless once she got out and living off of social security while she was trying to get her addiction under control. On September 28th, 2015, she was one year sober and she was able to pick up various shifts as a temp worker working at different care facilities. Elizabeth's neighbors noticed she had started drinking again, and she confided in one of her neighbors named Wade Messenger. She admitted that she had been bouncing around to various jobs once she left Caressant Care as she had been fired a couple of times. Once because she had been caught stealing medication and another time because she had almost killed a patient by giving them the wrong medication when she was high at work. So she also reached out to Sheila again six years after they had first met to vent to her that she was having trouble at work and that she couldn't figure out how to change a dressing on an IV line that goes to the heart. So it just seems like she's reaching out for help, but no one is really getting how serious her issues are.

Katie: Yeah, and I remember in that Fifth Estate episode, Sheila was like, "You've been a nurse for how many years and you don't know how to change a dressing. So it seems like, I dunno, Elizabeth is really bad at her job, or she's just going downhill and can't do the basics."

Stephanie: Other troubling behavior was evident when she was begging her neighbor Wade for some of his medical marijuana, as she claimed she was going through morphine withdrawal. Then one day she packed her suitcases and heads out. Her first instinct was to just escape her life and start over, and she got to Quebec before she turned around and checked herself into the Center for Addictions and Mental Health in Toronto. So clearly she recognizes that she's struggling and needs help. However, whatever she was going through doesn't excuse for what she had been doing for years while working as a nurse. She admits to the psychiatrist in Toronto some startling facts, but what she actually says has never been released to the public. However, according to the Fifth Estate, she does also confess to one of her childhood friends, Glen Hart, what she's done in a series of text messages to him, and this is what she has to say. She tells Glen that she had some really major anger issues and was taking it out on her patients, but criminologist Christopher Berry-Dee suggests on Confessions of a Serial Killer that she actually just enjoys killing people. She was purposely killing them by injecting them with an overdose of insulin. She also confesses to the staff at the Center for Addictions and Mental Health. In October, 2016, she goes down to the police station in Toronto and requests to talk to an officer so she could confess in person. She also confesses to stealing some of the patient's Hydromorphone, which is more commonly known under the name Dilaudid. It's an opiate and used to treat pain, so she was taking this pain medication away from the patients that actually needed it, so they were likely suffering in pain because of her as well. So you can see she just didn't care. She just liked to kill for the adrenaline it gave her, I guess. That's just awful to me. The police actually took what she was saying seriously. But what's crazy is that this is not the first time that she's actually confessed. According to Michelle McQuigge from C B C News, Elizabeth had previously confessed at least one of her murders to a pastor who just prayed over it and told her not to kill again. When she confessed to a lawyer, that lawyer just advised her to "Take her murderous secret to her grave."

AJ: What the hell is wrong with all these people? Why would they just say that? Keep it a secret and just pray about it and never do it again. Who are these people? I feel like they should definitely be, you know, charged with something. Who does that?

Katie: Well, I feel like a lawyer, that's literally their job is to keep their client out of jail. So, I mean, you're allowed, obviously, to confess to your lawyer that you killed people, that you're a murderer and they don't have a legal obligation to tell. I mean, that's what their actual job is not to tell. So, I guess I understand the lawyer, but the pastor. I mean, maybe he's not legally obligated as well. Can you confess to your pastor that you've murdered someone and they don't have to tell? I don't know. I've never confessed, don't go to church, I don't know the rules, but I feel like that's a bit, you know, hypocritical.

AJ: Yeah, the amount of shit that they probably get told through confessions and stuff is probably a lot, but I feel like there shouldn't be an exemption. If they get told that somebody murdered somebody, I feel like you should report that. I don't think just cuz you're a pastor...

Stephanie: I feel like if somebody came to me and said I murdered somebody, isn't it my obligation to go tell the police?

Katie: Well yeah, you, but you're not a pastor.

Stephanie: No.

AJ: But why does a pastor get a free ride? Get a free pass?

Katie: I don't know. I don't know if they do. I feel like maybe as a pastor, if you confess that you're going to hurt somebody or that somebody is in danger because of you, they have to tell. But if you've already done it, then it's like, "Well, nothing I can do, and so just pray for you instead. God bless."

AJ: God is good. He'll forgive you if you forgive yourself or something.

Stephanie: God is good. Good God.

Katie: Yeah, basically. Yeah. You're forgiven. Thanks for letting me know. I don't know.

Stephanie: Yeah, I don't know either. When she confessed to a Narcotics Anonymous sponsor, that person dismisses her as being a pathological liar. Additionally she even told her ex-boyfriend who thought she was just having a psychotic episode and did not believe her as well.

AJ: I didn't actually know all that information that she had confessed all those other times before. I just watched the Fifth Estate episode and a little bit of other things. But I never knew that she, cuz the way they presented it in the Fifth Estate makes it seem like that's the first time she confessed was at CAMH to the psychologist. I didn't know that she had done it all these times before. That's crazy to me. The Narcotics Anonymous guy is just like, "You're a pathological liar." I mean, maybe she is, but she wasn't lying about that.

Katie: I know. Yeah. It does seem crazy. It does seem like she was reaching out for help and everyone was just dismissing her.

Stephanie: I think that's why she got away with it for so long, because people just never believed her, and they never, when those elderly people died, they never did look into that. If they would've looked into it at the beginning, then this wouldn't have carried on for as long as it did.

AJ: And I wonder why she was confessing to all those people. I just, in my mind, I'm wondering. Was it a cry for help? Was she hoping somebody would report her? Was she proud of it and she was bragging about it? I'm just curious as to what would've prompted her to do that.

Stephanie: I think she wanted the attention. I think she wanted to, like you said, brag about it and want that attention, but nobody was really taking her seriously.

Katie: I think it does come out later though, that she did feel bad about what she was doing, so maybe she was telling people so that she could have help stopping, but also she still enjoyed doing it. So it was like if she had the chance she was going to, so I think she was conflicted maybe, or that's what she presented in some of her confessions anyway, but I mean, who knows?

AJ: Yeah. Also, it was like an adrenaline rush maybe for her, but also she felt compelled to do it. I don't wanna jump ahead too far, but I feel like there was something in the Fifth Estate where it's almost like she felt God or some being was telling her to do it. So she felt like she had to, even though she felt bad. So it's almost like, yeah, you said she was conflicted and maybe she was hoping that by telling people that they would intervene for her.

Stephanie: After the police investigated, it came out that she had murdered eight people by overdosing them with insulin. She was also charged with four counts of attempted murder and two counts of aggravated assault on other patients, along with the eight counts of murder. Elizabeth says, like I said before, that she has a lot of anger issues, and after her first killing, it made her feel, "Like a pressure lifted from my emotions." She describes it as a voice inside her head telling her to do it, and then once she did it, she said she would hear a laughter in her tummy. She also says that it's God telling her to kill and that she feels like God has failed her when she tries to kill, but isn't successful. When she confesses to police, she does try to justify her actions by saying she was addicted to prescription drugs, so she wasn't thinking clearly and also claims that her male victims had sexually assaulted her. So in her mind she was justifying what she had done to them. She also sent an email to CNO to resign as a registered nurse because she was purposely harming patients. She had the staff fax a four page handwritten confession. In her confession statement she says that she was just angry, angry at her job, angry at her life, and these people that she chose to murder and assault were people that still were enjoying life and their loved ones were still enjoying spending time with them. She just did it because she was angry. She also felt that she was helping some of them end their life because they were unhappy, and so it was the right thing to do, just end their misery. The death of James Silcox wasn't her first attempt. It was just her first successful killing. Her first try was an 87 year old dementia patient named Clotilde Adriano, who survived the attack, which was sometime between June 25th and December 31st, 2007. In that same timeframe, she attempted to give a lethal overdose to Clotilde's, sister Albina as well, but was unsuccessful. After this was the murder of James and Maurice as mentioned earlier, and in 2008 was two more murder attempts of Michael Priddle and Wayne Hedges, and then in 2011 is her killing spree of Gladys, Helen, and Mary. In July of 2013, she murdered 90 year old Helen Young. In March of 2014, she killed 79 year old Maureen Pickering. And then in August, 75 year old Arpad. So all of these I just mentioned happened while she worked at Caressent Care. And then in September of 2015, she attempted to kill 77 year old Sandra Towler, a resident of another retirement home, and then 68 year old Beverly Bertram at a private residence in August of 2016. It's crazy to think that she got away with it for so long, and I feel like if it wasn't for her coming forward, then these murders and assaults probably would never have been investigated, and she could have kept on killing. The fact that she was able to work at, like we said earlier, work at multiple homes for so long and none of them really noticed it was her just boggles my mind. All of these could have been avoided if she just was fired from that first job and then she wasn't able to move on to the other ones.

Katie: Yeah, and I think it's because, like you said earlier, it was a long-term care home. So older people that are sick, passing away in their sleep isn't unheard of, right so why would you think that anything was happening? It was just like a natural thing. So, yeah, it's crazy. And like you said, if she didn't confess, she probably just would've kept going and nobody, maybe eventually they would've caught on, but yeah, I think it would've been a while.

AJ: Yeah, it's almost like it was the perfect crime in a way. You know the people that she was targeting, like you said, it's not unheard of for people to die in their sleep at that old age. So if it wasn't for her own confession, she could have kept going and I don't even know if people would have caught on. I mean, yeah, she's doing this all, but it's all at different homes, especially when she was the temp worker. It could be one person on each different one, and they're not communicating with each other, you know? They barely, I feel like they barely probably communicate within their own organization, let alone with others. So they might never have put the pieces together. So it's crazy to think that she actually turned herself in.

Katie: I know it's true. They might never have put those pieces together unless she just went on a spree and just started overdosing everybody, all of her patients. But yeah, because it was so spread out, I think, and because these people were sick, it was just like, "Yeah, they're dying, she happens to be there." So...

AJ: Yeah, and I also wonder too, before she worked at Caressant Care, what the average was for the amount of people that died. You know, someone might think, "Oh after she came, all these people suddenly died when as before it wasn't as many." So maybe it could have been suspicious then, but not suspicious enough where you would actually think like, "Oh she's killing these people." But it might make you think, "Oh it's weird."

Katie: I also think it's sad too, how when you were saying she was stealing their pain medication, cuz these people literally needed it and they were in pain because of her, but nobody really knew so that's disturbing as well.

AJ: I mean, we don't know too much I would say about her, her childhood per se, just cuz you know, you always hear in serial killers, they have red flags maybe in their upbringing or something where they maybe kill small animals or something like that. The markings of a psychopath. Whereas I feel like with her, it's just very interesting to think about what was the tipping point? Was there a certain event in her life that made her go over the edge or was it just a random thing that would've happened anyway regardless cuz there's nothing, the first one would've been, like you said, was in 2008 or 2007, her first attempt. So it's just interesting. What happened at that time? That was her divorce maybe or something around that time.

Katie: Yeah, it also may have something to do with her mental illness, like she was diagnosed with borderline personality disorder. So yeah, she's obviously struggling mentally. She maybe just couldn't get her medication straight. She was obviously, you know, an alcoholic taking other kind of drugs. Everyone who is in that situation doesn't kill people, but I feel like that mix of everything wasn't helping.

Stephanie: And she didn't really have a support system. So she was on her own trying to deal with all of these mental illnesses and maybe if she had somebody to confide in and get some help maybe the outcome would've been different. But it's hard to say.

Katie: Yeah, I feel like she, she tried to have a support system by telling people how she was feeling and she was, you know, posting those poems and she was actually literally telling people, but nobody really took her seriously. So I feel like that wasn't helping the situation. And yeah, she had a God complex, right? Cuz she said she liked that control and so she was choosing who she was gonna kill and I think she enjoyed that.

AJ: And obviously, I mean, she did feel bad about it. I mean, not everyone just goes and confesses themselves. Most people, I mean, most all serial killers that I can think of were people that wouldn't have stopped unless they were caught by the police or by someone else. Right? So the fact that she actually went and turned herself in, like obviously maybe she did feel bad about it. I mean, she still did it, so obviously it's not a good thing but the fact that she turned herself in, I guess she could make the argument that she did feel bad about it, at least to a degree.

Katie: Maybe, or she just wanted that recognition cuz I mean, if she would've just never confessed, then she would have gotten away with it, but then nobody would've known. So you know how there are some cases where serial killers want to be recognized for all their killings or what they've done. And so if she didn't confess and went to the police then nobody would know what she did. So I feel like she did want that recognition. Maybe that it could have been part.

AJ: I didn't really get that vibe from her though. I guess if you're watching her interrogation video or maybe, you know, I mean obviously she's has some mental illness and psychopathic tendencies I guess, to some degree, but I just didn't get the sense that she was someone who was a narcissist who loved the attention. You obviously get that from people like Jeffrey Dahmer or Ted Bundy. To me, she just doesn't have that sort of serial killer vibe, which makes it even scarier cuz she's not your typical, she's not someone that you would typically see as a serial killer. Right? She doesn't fit the profile.

Katie: Yeah, that's true. It wasn't like she was bragging about it. I think you're right. I think it was more like she was reaching out for help and did wanna stop even though she liked it, but that's why she needed help cause she couldn't stop on her own.

AJ: It's almost like she was compelled or what Steph was saying, you know, there was you know, the voice or God telling her to do it so she felt like she had to do it, but she still didn't enjoy doing it. So she was hoping someone would intervene for her by telling all these people maybe?

Katie: Yeah, I feel like that's probably more accurate.

AJ: Yeah. I don't get the sense that she was telling all these people cuz she wanted to brag about it, like how cool she was. I mean, maybe who knows, but I feel like it's more of like, "No, I know there's something wrong, but I can't stop doing it."

Katie: Yeah.

Stephanie: So instead of a preliminary hearing, Wettlaufer just confessed to all of the charges against her and would plead guilty on June 1st, 2017. She was heard saying that she knew right from wrong, and when she committed the crimes, she continued to say that she had urges and when she killed, those urges got more intense. Like I said earlier, she had told her friends and her partner and her coworkers. No one really took her seriously. That made her feel angry, and that's when those urges got even stronger. So you can tell how evil she was and the fact that no one really believed her, who knows how long these killings would've continued, and she probably would've never been caught if she never did confess. Wettlaufer says that she got pleasure from killing these people, but that she also felt horrible each time she killed each of her victims. On June 26th, she was sentenced to eight concurrent life terms in prison, and she's not eligible for parole for 25 years. In June of 2018, there was an inquiry that was supposed to take place, and this inquiry was requested by Health Minister Eric Hoskins and Attorney General Yaser Naqvi. This inquiry came on the same day, Wettlaufer was given a life sentence. They want to make sure that this sort of crime does not happen again and want to ensure the public and those who worked in the home care center that they are safe. On July 31st, 2019, the inquiry says, "Systematic failures in long-term care allowed Wettlaufer to carry out her crimes without raising suspicion." It calls for fundamental changes to prevent such tragedies in the future. There has been no new information since then, so I'm assuming the inquiry is still continuing on.

Katie: I think that was the inquiry. It's just that they need to, you know, raise their standards and somehow prevent this. Yeah, like I don't know how you would prevent somebody else that wanted to come along and do the same thing, I think it would be really hard to prevent this every single time.

AJ: Well, I mean, maybe having it on someone's record would be one. So the first time they're fired for doing medication errors, maybe having a red flag would be helpful.

Katie: That's true. Yeah. Maybe if it happens more than once, like twice, maybe look into it and look at their background and have some disciplinary action before they're allowed to continue on.

AJ: Yeah, and I feel like there's probably just such a disconnect between all the different long-term care homes. Like I said, they're probably not communicating with each other in any way, so you're never really going to know, you know what I mean? No one is gonna be aware of what's happening in the other ones so it is hard and also makes you wonder how many times this has happened in the past. Maybe there's a bunch of people that have done similar things, we just don't know about them cuz they didn't confess and like you said, you don't really think too much of it when it happens in a long-term care home.

Katie: Yeah. Or maybe even someone that doesn't do it on purpose, but they're just not paying attention and they're, "Oh, whoops. I gave somebody insulin too much when I shouldn't have, and now they're dead." But no one's gonna know cause it's a long-term care home, so don't even bother looking into it. Right?

AJ: Yeah.

Katie: So I mean, that could happen way more often than we know, which is scary.

AJ: Yeah. And the fact that they don't really disclose any of these things and their records are private, we'll never know probably either.

Katie: And I mean, sadly it's probably part of the job. You know, you fuck up, give somebody the wrong thing, doesn't kill them every time. But I feel like people should know about that and you know, whether it's intentional or not, it happened.

AJ: Yeah. But I'm also surprised too that she didn't try to go for the insanity defense, cuz I feel like most times people do try that. It seems like it was pretty easy. She confessed to it. You know, she said she knew right from wrong. It wasn't even a trial, it was just her sentencing. So I'm surprised that she didn't go, or her lawyers didn't try to go for the insanity defense, you know, saying she had a mental illness. She wasn't aware of what she was doing to potentially get a lesser sentence or something.

Katie: Maybe, I think it was in Confessions of a Serial Killer, I think where they reenact her confession and her lawyer's not there, it's just her, and she is saying like," I knew right from wrong. I was angry. I wanted to do this. I had this feeling. I felt good after it. It was too far gone at that point."

AJ: Oh, I guess, yeah. So even the lawyer was like, "There's nothing we can do."

Stephanie: She never, went to actual trial because she just confessed to those murders anyways, so it's not like she could, well, I mean, guess she could still plead insanity, but like Katie said, she just...

Katie: Yeah, I feel like she's just confessed and was accepting her punishment and she knew what she did was wrong, so she felt like she deserved it I guess. So yeah.

AJ: Yeah. Sad. That's why I suggested this one for you to do Steph, just cause I think it's a bit unique. I don't really, I mean unless, except for that good nurse, the case that that show the Good Nurse or movie's based on.

Katie: Yeah. But he didn't confess himself. Right? I think what makes this unique too is that she admitted everything and turned herself in basically.

AJ: Yeah, I just feel like you don't really see too many women serial killers, so anytime there is one, it's always just really interesting because it's so, I would have to say like 95% of the serial killers that are out there at least are men. So when you hear it's a woman serial killer, it's automatically a bit unique.

Katie: Or maybe women are just way better at it. They're not getting caught.

AJ: True. So maybe there's way more women serial killers out there. We just don't know.

Katie: Yeah, the men are just stunned or like stupid and get caught, and the women are just out there killing and not getting caught.

AJ: So, interesting case. Yeah, definitely interesting. I feel so bad for all those families too. In the Fifth Estate documentary too, on this case, when they're interviewing the family members of all those people who died in the long-term care homes. Especially finding this out so long after, because it's like reliving it again, right? They died, some of them in 2008 or 2009, whatever, and then having to relive it all almost a decade later when she confesses to it, when you've already made peace with it and now you're like, "Oh, they actually didn't die of natural causes, they were murdered."

Katie: Yeah, it's sad. You grieve cuz you think they died naturally and peacefully, but then you find out that they were actually murdered and they could potentially have lived for years after happily. So yeah, that it is really sad.

Stephanie: It was eight concurrent life sentences. So how long is that?

Katie: No, concurrent means they run at the same time, so...

Stephanie: Oh, okay.

Katie: ...after 25 years. She's eligible for parole after 25 years even though she killed eight people.

AJ: And she was relatively young, right? I don't know what age she was, but she could get out in 25 years and still have, it's not like she's gonna be 90 or something when she gets out. Right? She'll have...

Katie: Yeah. Well she was born in 67, went into jail. When did she go to jail?

AJ: She'd be 50...

Katie: Yeah.

AJ: ... in 2017. So she'll be 55 right now.

Katie: So after 25 years, I mean...

Stephanie: She would be 70 or...

AJ: She'll be 75, I guess.

Stephanie: 75.

Katie: Yeah. That's still relatively old.

AJ: Yeah. I mean, not young, not a spring chicken.

Stephanie: But she might end up in...

Katie: So she could at least have 20 years left of her life.

AJ: Yeah. She'll be in a long-term care home .

Katie: Yeah.

Stephanie: Well, that's the thing. Either she goes from getting outta prison to maybe a long-term care home, but also if she has mental issues, she could be going to a psychiatric ward maybe. I don't know. Maybe they have one in prison. I have no idea.

Katie: Maybe. Yeah. I feel like she definitely needs some kind of help, but I also feel like people don't really care if you're mentally ill in prison.

AJ: Yeah.

Katie: And also when you get out it's like, "Too bad. See ya."

AJ: I know. Yeah. And I also feel like she would be, I feel like she would be the type of person who would be getting parole in 25 years because she probably wouldn't be considered a high risk to re-offend. She'd be on the older side.

Stephanie: Would she re-offend again though? I feel like she might.

AJ: Well, I mean, not the same way. She's not gonna be a nurse at a long-term care home.

Stephanie: No.

Katie: Yeah. There's no way she's gonna get a job as a nurse again after that?

AJ: No. So I mean, she could, yeah, she could kill, but it wouldn't be using the same methods. And also she'd be 75. I feel like she's probably, I mean, I could be making assumptions, she's probably well behaved in prison. I can't see her, you know, causing a ton of trouble maybe. So I feel like she would be the type that after 25 years was like, "Okay, you'll get off on good behavior. You know, you've been a model prisoner, you can get out." So there is a chance for sure. It's 20 years from now. More or less 20 years.

Katie: But yeah. But maybe her but her because of her mental health, I feel like she's gonna deteriorate maybe pretty quickly in there. That's my assumption, but ...

AJ: Yeah. Yeah, that's true. That's true. But yeah, sad case for sure. And yeah, definitely an interesting one to cover.

Okay. That does it for this week's episode of Crime Family. Thank you so much for tuning in. Join us next week for our final part of the miniseries. So if you like the show and you wanna follow us on social media, you can follow us @ crimefamilypodcast on Instagram. We're @crimefamilypod1 on Twitter, and Crime Family Podcast on Facebook. We're also, available by email, so you can email us at crimefamilypodcast@gmail.com. If you wanna send us case suggestions or your feedback on the show or you just wanna reach out to us, get in touch with us, you can also reach out to us on our website as well. It's crimefamilypodcast.ca. You can send us a little message on there. You can leave a voicemail on our website as well. If you would like to get merch, you can check out our Red Bubble store. The link is in the show notes. And also we'll put a link to our Patreon page. You can join us and get lots of great benefits for supporting the show. The link is in the show notes as well. So thank you so much. We'll see you next time for the final part of the mini-series. We're excited for that one. So thanks so much and take care. Bye

Stephanie: Bye.

Katie: Bye.