S03E10: SYNANON (CULT MINISERIES, PART II)

AJ: Coming up on this episode of Crime Family.

What would eventually become what is deemed one of the "most dangerous and violent cults America had ever seen", actually started as a drug rehabilitation center that was founded by Charles Dederich Sr in 1958. Charles participated in a study involving LSD and he says that, you know, taking part of that study is the single most important event in his life.

All of the women were forced to get abortions. The men were pressured into getting vasectomies.

Katie: It started out as such a good thing and like a good idea. And it was actually helping people. It sucks that it, like every cult goes down this bad road.

You know, if you want to continue to be here, then that's what you have to do. And so a lot of them just figured that that's what they had to do. So they like "willingly", I say that in air quotes, "did it".

AJ: Hi, everyone. Welcome to Crime Family. I am your co-host AJ and I'm here with my sisters, Stephanie and Katie as always. Just want to put a little disclaimer on this episode. So I am traveling right now and I'm not using my regular equipment, not my regular computer or my regular mic. So I'm making do with what I have, like, I currently have a, a different mic with a sock for the pop filter. So we're definitely, we're getting creative and we're trying to make it work. So if the audio quality is a little bit less than what you're used to just please bear with us because it's, we're, we're doing our best,

For this week's episode, our four-part mini series is going to continue. So last week, Steph told us about the "Children of God" cult, and it was pretty crazy. And so this week I'm going to be telling you all about another cult, but this is one I think is a little bit lesser known than the "Children of God". Maybe I'm wrong, but I've never heard of it until recently, and there's not a ton of information out there in the form of, you know, documentaries or stuff. Like there is a few little things out there and some good articles, but I feel like this is definitely one that many people won't really know too much about going in and it's called Synanon and Katie, you actually suggested it to me and I guess you knew it would be one that I'd be interested in looking into, right? Like there's probably a reason you suggested this particular one to me?

Katie: Yeah. So I was just watching some cult shows, documentaries just to kind of get some inspiration for my own research, and this one stood out to me because it kind of started out as like a mental health facility. And so that's kind of right up your alley, so I felt like it would be most interesting to you.

AJ: For our listeners who don't know, which is probably all of you, I studied Addictions and Mental Health in school, and I worked in that field for a few years. So conversations or cases that revolve around addiction or mental health are kind of in my wheelhouse, and this case does revolve around that topic because what would eventually become what is deemed one of the "most dangerous and violent cults America had ever seen", actually started as a drug rehabilitation center that was founded by Charles Dederick Sr in 1958. So yeah, like I was looking around for cults that I could cover for this series and I really didn't know which one I wanted to do, and I feel like there's so many out there, but there was not a particular one that I was thinking of, so when you suggested this one, Katie, I easily I fell down the rabbit hole because like I said, it falls in line with what I'm interested in and yeah, so it's pretty crazy. So we're going to get right into it. But first I just wanted to ask you guys, if you have ever heard of the phrase "Today's the first day of the rest of your life"?

Katie: Yeah, I have.

Stephanie: Yes.

AJ: So I feel like this phrase is commonly used within the context of, you know, self-help initiatives or motivational speeches and stuff like that. So you know, it means, you know, each day can be a clean slate to forget the troubles of your past and look forward to a brighter future with today being the first step towards that future. So Charles Dederich Sr was the one who is kind of credited with coining this term, which I found pretty interesting. And he coined this term back during the foundational years of what would later become known as Synanon. He had struggled with alcoholism in his own life in the years leading up to this, and so he opened up the first Synanon center in Santa Monica, California in 1958. His hope initially was to bridge the gap in services that were being offered by alcoholics anonymous, which he did become a faithful member of in 1956 or around there. And he really wanted to bridge this gap because in his view, AA was geared strictly towards people with alcohol addiction and didn't really accept people who were suffering with other types of addictions. So his hope for Synanon was that it would welcome people with many different addictions in order to be more inclusive. So that was his initial goal and kind of what motivated him to start this own separate addiction treatment / self-help sort of group. But I think it's important to provide a little bit more context into, you know, like society's views of addiction during the 1950s, because I think it'll be kind of important to know that before going into the specifics of this particular cult. So the attitude towards addiction at this time is far different than it is today. Today I think we largely see addiction as a, as a disease and we understand that anybody can fall victim to it just as you would, could fall victim to any other disease out there. So of course there may be certain factors that can cause someone to be at a higher risk for developing an addiction in their life, just as there are certain risk factors for people who develop physical ailments like cancer or diabetes. So yeah, I think that's kind of like the largely or larger health view is that, you know, addiction is a disease and people understand that a little bit more now than probably back in the fifties. So a lengthy article by LA Magazine, and that's where a lot of the information about this cult that I cover in this episode comes from. So this article does provide great context on this issue. The author of the article Hillel Aron, says "Well into the 1950s addicts were considered hopelessly incurable. If they were treated at all, it was by doctors in hospitals. More often than not, they were sent to jail". So people in these days were never actually given the treatment that they really needed, because I guess if they were deemed incurable, then the view was why would we even treat them or try to cure them because addiction was sort of seen as, you know, once you have it, there's no way to really get over it and it's going to just kind of follow you forever. So they didn't really put much effort into actually trying to overcome it. In a way, what would eventually become Synanon did have humble beginnings and initially opened the door to the thought of rehabilitation centers for people with addiction. So while there were treatment centers that did exist, they were just not as well known or mainstream as maybe they are today. So while Synanon was not the first addiction treatment center, it did play a critical part in shifting society's views of addiction and those suffering with it. And in the late 1950s, so this was, I think, just a year or two before he started Synanon, Charles participated in a study involving LSD, and they were kind of, I guess the aim of the study, what I got from it was that the study was sort of looking to see if LSD could be used as a potential cure or a treatment for alcoholism. So that's why, because he was a recovering alcoholic, he, that's why he decided to take part in this study. And he says that, you know, taking part in that study is the single most important event in his life. He says that it, you know, gave him a whole new direction. He kinda came out of that as a whole different person, and it changed his perspective on a lot of different aspects of his life. That's not a direct quote, but that's kind of the gist of it. So he says that a lot of things that sort of happen in his life after Synanon, or during Synanon and the creating of it can be linked back to this moment in his life. So I don't really know exactly like the extent of it, like no article I found ever went into detail about what specifically about this, but he took LSD and loved it, I guess, and whatever happened he, he marks it as a very important event in his life. So, you know, he started, he started Synanon as just one addiction treatment center in Santa Monica, California, but then it slowly started to evolve into a bunch of different centers. Soon after starting it Charles had larger, more dangerous ambitions. So obviously it started out as, you know, a more innocent thing with good intentions, obviously he wanted to, you know, like I said, make it more inclusive and include people with all different addictions and stuff like that, but later on, like these more dangerous ambitions sort of became like, he essentially wanted to start an entire society to "transform the world". Originally called "Tender Loving Care", that was the name of the first center so that was before it was known as Synanon, but the center required all new clients to stop taking substances cold turkey, meaning that they were in severe withdrawal for the first few days of the program, and they were told to cut off all contact with friends and family for the first 30 days of being in the program. So I guess looking back, you know, these, these circumstances are kind of a prime environment to create loyal, dedicated followers. I think you take an extremely vulnerable person, you put them through this intense withdrawal period, and you don't allow them to talk to anyone in the outside world or anyone that they love, outside of the center. So by the end of the 30 days, it doesn't really seem farfetched that they would kind of emerge from the other side of withdrawal, a bit closed off from the outside world. And, you know, they would have a huge appreciation for these people that they see as having helped them through the toughest time of their lives. So then, I think, you know, it's not a huge leap to think that they would start kind of gravitating more towards these group, this group of people and away from the people on the outside. So when you think about it, that way, it kind of makes sense how someone in that vulnerable situation could very easily and very quickly be sucked into this group, into Synanon and the cult that existed underneath all of it.

Katie: It's also when you have a bunch of people and they kind of go through a unique experience that no one else has, but they do it together. Then they kind of, you know, gain loyalty to that group. And so they feel like nobody else understands what they went through and that kind of brings them closer together to the point where we see it, they, they stay with this kind of nonsensical group or extreme beliefs because they feel like no one else can really understand what they went through. So I feel like that going through what you just described could kind of do that for these people.

AJ: Yeah, that's true. It has a kind of like a, like an intense sort of bonding experience for everyone. You know, they're all, they're going through a similar thing, and like you said, no one else who hasn't gone through it could really relate.

Katie: Also this theme will come back up in, especially our last cult that we're going to cover. This kind of theme, where they try to have an exclusive experience with the members to kind of bring them closer together. So that's kind of a theme that we see a lot in cults.

AJ: Yeah. Yeah. And that's definitely the one thing I'm noticing from the "Children of God" one and then doing this one, and then that last one we're going to do, there is a lot of common themes that you see that exist. I feel like you'd have like a checklist and like a cult, if it's a cult, it's going to check off all of them, all of the boxes. So a lot of them are similar in that way and this one definitely does check off a lot of those boxes.

Katie: Yeah. And another common theme that comes up in most cases or a lot of cases, they start out as trying to do something good or they have like a good goal in mind and then it goes awry.

AJ: Yeah, that's definitely true. I feel like most cults I know of off the top of my head, I feel like they're all similar because nobody, you know, nobody was going to join a cult thinking that it's going to be doing bad things for the world. Like obviously everyone who's in it kind of believes that they're in something for the greater good or something bigger than themselves or something. So I feel like that is kind of a common theme or a thread that you see through a lot of these cults, because I feel for the most part, nobody's, you know, walking the streets, looking for an evil group to join so they could do horrible things. Like it's under the guise of like helping or a self-help group or helping the world or saving the world or whatever, like something like that. And so this one, yeah, like obviously, like I said, it was under the guise of addiction treatment is what an initially started out as. So, like I said, in the early years, Synanon was named "Tender Loving Care", or "Tender Love and Care Club". I've seen different articles that say different things. And in the beginning this club operated in a sketchy storefront in Santa Monica, California. And right from the very beginning, the members of this club started operating in a way that was perceived as a "game". That's how it was kind of sold to them or told to them initially. The members were allowed to say anything they wanted to say to other members, whether they were true or not hoping to incite a reaction from the individual that they were engaging with. So Synanon which is a kind of a weird thing, so I feel like a lot of times he was kind of testing them and he was obviously watching closely their every move. And it was kind of a lot of it was just like mind games, and trying to turn them against each other, or turn them against themselves in some ways. So there was like people in the neighborhood and like the surrounding buildings and stuff that they did not want this group moving right next door. And they were harassed from very early on, Synanon was, so, they kind of just had a bad rap from the beginning, in this little small community, like I think it had a better reputation sort of more to like the public, but the people who were in like the direct vicinity of the first building, like the surrounding neighbors, did start kind of harassing Synanon early on. Most of the attacks were unjustified or, you know, were brought on by racism or fear of having, you know, people with addictions, like in the, in the neighborhood, you know, it's kind of the same sort of attitude we see a lot of times too, people say like, "oh, you can have a rehab center just not next door to me or not in my neighborhood". So it was a kind of a lot of that going on. So a lot of the attacks were kind of unjustified in that way, but then some of the attacks were also, you know, in response to some of the things that Synanon was doing. In 1959, so this would have been just about a year after it opened the "Tender Loving Care Club", switched locations. And whether it's because of this new location or not, but the club started to get noticed and their popularity really did begin to grow. It was around this time that Dederich gets arrested for operating without a health license and for being unzoned or like the building wasn't zoned. He was offered probation instead, but he decided to go to jail. So that was what he chose to do when they were just going to give him probation for operating without a license. And I wasn't able to actually find any information on how long this initial jail sentence was, but it didn't seem like he had too bad of a time in jail. And he was actually almost considered a hero in some, some respects or in some circles. And governor Edmund Brown Sr actually signed a save Synanon bill. So I think it was kind of deemed to the, or it was kind of represented to the public as he, you know, he did a bad thing cause he didn't have a health license and he was operating without a license. But because they had such a great reputation, it was sort of like he was sort of seen as the martyr, like he was going to be, he was going to jail, but it wasn't really justified or I guess in the public's eyes, it wasn't justified. And then there was the Governor, he actually signed the "Save Synanon" bill instead of having it shutdown or, which leads to later events, which I'll I'll get into. Because the bill was signed Synanon was allowed to operate without a license going forward, and this meant that because they didn't have a license, but they were, it was legal or in their case it was, so they were allowed to start having members quit "cold turkey" without the help of any drugs or anything like that. So they were really allowed to do things in an unorthodox sort of way. And it was due to this "Save Synanon" bill that this governor had signed, cause I guess he really respected Charles Dederich and thought that he was doing a good thing and didn't really want to see the organization of Synanon go down because of this little caveat of not having a health license. So he kind of allowed it to go on continuing to do these things that vary in a very unorthodox way. And in addition to his popularity, while incarcerated, many of the rich in Hollywood actually started donating some money to Synanon and by the end of 1959, which is only about a year into its existence Synanon had more than $30 million in assets. Because I guess in their eyes, like in the early, like in the late 50's he was kind of revolutionizing the way people thought about addiction. On the surface he was, so I guess everyone thought it was like, do a super progressive thing and it was a good thing. And that's why they donated money to it, obviously. But in a year he was able to amass $30 million worth of assets, which is pretty crazy. By the 1960s, Synanon became a pretty happening hangout within Hollywood and a lot of notable actors had made speeches at Synanon at different events that they had held and by the middle of the 60's Synanon decided to build their own city in Marin County, California, which was just like a series of different sort of residences or a series of different compounds within the same area of Marin County, California. This would eventually lead to Synanon owning three sites in that county, which was about 3,300 acres altogether owned by Synanon and the different sort of buildings that they had operated. Synanon, the name of it that eventually became Synanon, it was supposed to, it was from symposium and anonymous, like from alcoholics anonymous. So that was where the name came to be, like meshing those two words together. So that's how he came up with the name Synanon and that changed from "Tender Loving Care", which was the initial name of it in 1958. In 1967, or around that time they were rapidly expanding and this was due to, they suddenly started to allow people without addictions into the mix. People started, they wanted to be a part of the movement and they wanted to be involved in like the activities and stuff that were going on because it did have such a good reputation. So people were starting to enter and joined the community and entering into these facilities without even having an addiction, just because I guess they love sort of the idea of this carefree sort of revolutionizing, "we're going to change, change the world. We're creating our own sort of society". And I guess people love that sort of notion. These people were referred to as squares because they were clean and sober and they didn't have any addiction. They went from initially having about 40 original people in the, in the rehab facility, in the beginning to in the late sixties, having over 823 members that were living within the compounds that they owned in this, in this county. And then in 1968, there was a new membership that formed that allowed members of synonyms to get jobs outside of the group and live outside of the compound as well. However, they did have to give most of their income that they would make back to Synanon. However, this kind of membership did not last long because members were often accused of not being committed enough.

Stephanie: It kind of sounds like the cult that we're going to be doing at the end of this mini series. Kind of like, oh, I want to say like a pyramid, like pyramid scheme, but like they want you to work, but they want you to give them all their money.

AJ: So it was really when they got rid of like the whole notion of graduating that like things really started to change because then people were just staying and devoting their whole life to this sort of mission that, they all believed in.

Stephanie: Are there any rules or restrictions that they had to follow? Like, " you know how you see in like, the "Children of God'. Like there was this whole book of like restrictions and rules that these people had to follow to be part of the cult. Was there anything of that in this cult or was it just, you can do whatever you want, but you had to devote some of your time to this cult?

AJ: Well, there's definitely like certain rules that like, I'll get a little bit into it about like, sort of the appearance of everyone who is there and also it's a little bit unclear, I'll get into a little bit of like where the line was, whether it was sort of, there was kind of a debate about whether he was sort of telling everyone what to do, or if he was just getting in their heads enough to where they would make the decision themselves. Kind of like, you know, manipulating, like getting into their heads and then they would make the decision. Like he wasn't like putting a gun to their head and, you know, telling them to do something, but it was more like he would heavily suggest it and then, because they respected him so much or they looked up to him so much that they would just do it or follow the rules or you know, go along with the crowd, what everyone else was doing. But due to the massive expansions that were taking place Synanon was now generating around $1.2 million of revenue, every, every month. And this included the revenue from their branded promotional items in gas stations. So I can say they owned and operated a set of local gas stations and which is really random. But, by the end of the 60's members could only see their kids once a week. And by the early 1970s, Dederich announced that every child from every California branch be moved to a single site in Marin County, and this became the last straw for many and Synanon lost about 200 to 300 followers, which was a significant portion after he kind of invoked this rule. And then Synanon rebranded themselves in 1970 as a psychotherapy program, rather than a drug treatment program. And this rebranding garnered a lot of attention from the middle-class people. So before it was a lot of people with lower income, or no housing. They were homeless or whatever, like that but the middle-class people started to get a lot of attention after it kind of rebranded as a psychotherapy program, cause obviously it has a different connotation then, if it's a drug treatment program. And one of the major things was that in 1974, Synanon was granted religious status by the federal government and this meant that Synanon did not need to, they were given tax exempt status by the IRS. As a result because they, if you are a church or if you are a religion, you don't have to pay taxes, which is a big thing that we see in, Scientology. In Scientology they're tax exempt, and they don't have to pay taxes and so if they don't have to pay taxes, then all of the money that they're making, obviously they don't have to worry about paying any of it back through taxes. So that's a big, a big thing I know in some of the stuff I've seen about Scientology that is like one of the major reasons why they're still allowed to in their current status is because they have that tax exempt status by the IRS and we'll see later on in this case, how important that tax exempt status was. In 1975, there were three Synanon members who confessed to assaulting a Marin County rancher and another rancher who was pistol whipped by the group and two black couples were also beat up by Synanon members because the couples had parked in the Synanon parking lot. So it was just a lot of really violent behavior and attacks on random people that these people within Synanon were doing for like very benign reasons or very small sort of things.

In 1976, Dederich announced that all members should cease having kids. All of the women were forced to get abortions. He once said that "having an abortion is like squeezing a boil, nothing more." And the men were pressured into getting vasectomies and there was around 80 operations that took place in 1976 alone. So that was the kind of thing he was doing. He saw, I guess having children as a burden and he didn't think that any of the women should be having children within, which is weird because you think like a cult sort of you'd think that they would want them to have kids because then they could like have more people to replace the members. So that was a little bit weird.

Stephanie: It was just going to say that it's weird though, cause most cults that I've read about or watched documentaries on like they're forced to have as many kids that they can. So for a cult to not want that, it's just weird to, that seems weird to me. But also who was doing these surgeries? Was it like actual doctors or was it people inside the cult themselves?

AJ: Like, I think it was doctors, actually doctors that were doing it, but like, again, that's the thing is I feel like a lot of these articles and the documentary I watched, like the " Oxygen" documentary they just say like, these things were happening, but it doesn't necessarily say like the logistics of it. Like it doesn't say, I couldn't find like a detailed account of like someone who said that this exact thing happened and like everything, it was just kind of like people were being forced to have abortions and men were being forced to have vasectomies but it didn't really go into detail about like, what that looked like in terms of like, did they take them, did they kidnap them and take them off site to like a hospital to do it? Or like what that sort of was, but it was just sort of a thing that was known to be happening. Which was crazy. And I don't know, like you said, I feel like it's weird that they wouldn't want children to like replace because what are they going to do if none of them have children, then they're all just going to die off when they get old and then that's the end. Like you think if they're trying to start a new society in a new like community, they would want it to continue on.

Katie: For me, it just seems like the leader is very short-sighted. It's like, this is his lifetime. So having a bunch of kids that are going to grow up and have kids and be in this cult, it doesn't affect him cause he's not going to be there for like, you know, three, four generations down the road. So it's probably like it's costing him money. So let's just not bring kids into the cult anymore cause they're just a liability. They're an expense. So it saves him money.

AJ: Yeah, that's true. Actually, I didn't even think of that, but that's yeah, I guess true. And like, I guess maybe kids will be, yeah, just like a burden on him. Like having kids around, maybe he just didn't like having, having screaming children around or something. And like, just for his own like living requirements, he didn't want to be around a bunch of kids or something, or like it would distract the people within the community and they wouldn't be like completely focused on him all the time or something like that. Who really knows?

Katie: Yeah. Well, the one episode that I watched it was very much, had to do with financials. So it was like they had to make more space for the kids and they kind of had their own little school kind of thing. So that took up time. It took up, you know, like I said, space, it took up money. So if we just got rid of having more kids, then you wouldn't have to worry about that anymore.

AJ: Yeah and something that is really, really weird. Something that came up in some of the articles I read. In 1977, so Charles Dederich was married this whole time. So in 1977, his wife died and he was eager to remarry. So he put the word out that he was single and ready to mingle once again, and six women applied for the position of his new wife. He ended up choosing a 31 year old teacher at one of the Synanon schools cause they owned and operated like a bunch of schools within their little community. Then later on Dederich decided marriage should no longer be a forever thing, so then he told people within the community like husbands and wives, that they should be split up and to form new three-year long quote love matches. And it only took about a few days for 230 couples within the community to file for divorce. So it also seemed to that he was very like undecided. He was really eager to get married once his wife died. So then he got married, but then he decided that, oh, it's not a forever thing, like, it's just going to be in three-year increments so everyone who's been married for longer than that, you just get a divorce. 230 couples within this community filed for divorce shortly after he, he said all this stuff. So it did seem like they were going by whatever his, his, every word, whatever he said was, you know, the rule of the land or at least that's what they thought and so when you have 230 couples divorcing within or filing for divorce within a few days of each other, just because he says that love matches are the, are the way of the future. Pretty weird!

Katie: It's crazy. Like, I don't, I don't understand, like if you, monogamy is one thing, but if you feel like you don't want to be monogamous, then that's fine, but you don't have to get married. And then on a set schedule, get divorced and then marry someone else. Like just don't be married. Like I just don't understand these people. This fascination with, they have to be married. If you want multiple partners, and if you want whatever don't just don't get married. I don't understand the fascination with getting married. Maybe it's a church thing that I just don't get.

AJ: Yeah. Yeah. Maybe just like the whole way it seems very traditional and conventional. But yeah, it, it is weird. I don't know.

So there's a true crime series called "Deadly Cults" on the "Oxygen Network" and this series actually did an episode about Synanon. In season two, episode eight, they talk about an incident that occurred in 1978. So this would have been about 20 years after Synanon formed and it's, you know, far into its new way of life, I guess, like it's no longer kind of a drug rehabilitation center, it's sort of this whole new full on cult at this point, basically. But in 1978, a woman named Francis Winn was just walking on the beach and she was approached by a group of people and started talking with them and then eventually just decided to leave with them and she went into a van and they took a ride up to Northern California. Now Francis had a history of psychosis and depression and the people that she was talking to were members of Synanon and once they had her in the van, they took her up to their retreat or to their compound in Northern California and they refused to let her go. I guess, when she realized that these people had no good intentions for her, she wanted to go, but they would, you know, barred her from leaving. The woman's husband Ed Winn , eventually found out that, I guess, by talking to some people that she was talking to members of Synanon, again, the documentary doesn't go into detail about how he found out that these people were members of Synanon, but maybe they were overheard by people on the beach, or maybe this was a common thing. They would go to this particular beach and talk to a lot of people who were just by themselves walking or something like that. So maybe that's how they knew, but there was a woman named Narda Zacchino and she's a former journalist for the LA Times and she started to report on this story once she caught wind of this, and she kind of took it upon herself to call Synanon herself and inquire about why they took Francis and why they wouldn't let her go and why they wouldn't let her talk to her husband and all of that kind of stuff. Like I said, no one really knew the extent of sort of it's culty ways or kind of the way that they were all living or the way that they were all behaving. I think they did sort of have a much different, you know, appearance to the general public at this point. So, you know, whether they're talking to somebody on the beach and they take her in the van, and then they're not letting her go, then obviously that's super suspicious. So her husband eventually ended up going to the police and they basically told him that because Francis was an adult and she chose to go with them willingly that there wasn't really much that they could do because it wasn't like they had like, you know, dragged her and forced her into the van. It was like, they talked to her and she decided," Oh, this is going to be a good thing for me". And it was only later on when she got there that she didn't want to go. But I guess, because she got in the van willingly, they were like she's a consenting adult, so what can we do? He eventually went on to hire a lawyer named Paul Morantz and he actually goes to Synanon's compound in Northern California, or their retreat, or wherever they're living in Northern California. And this is when he kind of saw sort of what everyone within this group, like sort of their demeanor and what they looked like, and he was very suspicious and he says that everyone was smiling and happy, they all had shaved heads which is obviously what caught his eye and was super super-weird. Eventually Francis was released from the facility and returned back to her husband and the pair later sued Synanon for imprisonment and other charges, and it was Francis Winn and her husband who become important later on and they play a vital role in the downfall of Synanon. Once the Winns hire Paul Morantz as their lawyer, Paul really becomes a thorn in Charles' side because he's not going to let this go. They go in that first time and saw these people at this compound, he was very interested in like, what was really going on. So he, I guess, started to do a lot of investigation work or was really kind of, and he was leading the charge and like the lawsuit that Francis and Ed had filed. So Paul was a thorn in Charles' side for quite awhile because of his legal actions against Synanon, on behalf of the Winns and one of Synanon's buildings or one of their communities, I guess, like they used to have like an overarching sort of radio system so a lot of times Charles would go in there and it would kind of be like the radio they would listen to instead of the music, it would just be like him talking or him preaching the gospel, so to speak, or he would, you know, be, you know, filling them with his ideas, whatever, you know, basically like propaganda, if you want to think about it like that. It was Synanon's own private radio network and so for the longest time he would, you know, sit on this private radio system and say things like "Who is this guy Morantz and why doesn't somebody break his legs" and then he also said, "We are not going to mess with the old time, turn the other cheek religious posture. We're going to our religious posture is don't mess with us. You can get killed dead, physically dead. We either have a good thing here, or we don't. If we have a good thing here, then we are not going to permit people like greedy lawyers to destroy it." So this was the sort of mantras and the sort of things he was saying for, you know, a long period of time after he kind of became familiar with Morantz, and of course that's kind of the cult's MO too right? It is to go after anyone who is speaking out about the cult, to go after anyone who was taking legal action against them. So his idea is to just slander them and give them no credibility to anyone within the cult so then they're not going to believe a single word that this Paul guy has to say, because they're all just going by whatever Charles is telling them. So on the evening of October 11th, 1977, and the one thing about this cult or this case is that there's a lot of sort of conflicting dates. So the LA Magazine says that this event that I'm about to tell you happened in 1977, but the "Oxygen" documentary says that it was 1978 and I'm inclined to believe it had to be 1978 because the whole thing with Francis and Ed, when they took her against, or wouldn't let her go, that happened in 78, according to the "Oxygen documentary. So it would have to be later in 78 or at least, you know, so I don't think it could have been in 77, but there was an article like the LA magazine said 77, but whatever. Somewhere, either 77 to 78 Paul Morantz returned to his home, and this is after like he had already filed the lawsuit and after all of that stuff, so he returned to his home and he went to go collect the mail that was in the mail slot and I guess it was one of those sort of old school mail boxes that were just, it was like a little slot inside your house, I don't know how to really describe it, but it wasn't like just a slot where they dropped it like it would go on the floor, I guess they would just put it into there and you could like reach into it from the inside and grab the mail. But because it was dark inside the slot, obviously, and he didn't have his glasses on at the time, he could see like the outline of something in the mailbox and figured that it was just like a uniquely shaped gift or something. He didn't really know, it looked different than like a letter, but he wasn't quite sure what it was. It was a rattlesnake that bit Paul's hand when he placed it inside. So he immediately called 911 and knew that members of Synanon were responsible for placing the snake inside his mailbox. So he was quoted as saying, "I've been bitten by a rattlesnake. It's Synanon.. Synanon got me" and so an investigation was launched immediately as Paul was in critical condition in the hospital and in the documentary or in the episode, I guess, of this, of the show "Deadly Cults" they go into it and the investigators were able to determine that that particular species of rattlesnake was like about a hundred or hundreds of miles away from where it naturally lived. So the only way for it to get to this part of California would for it to have been transported there. So somehow they were able to determine that and they were able to determine that the snake had to have been placed inside the mailbox. It didn't just find its way inside the mail slot and they found out that that is exactly what happened and that the snake was placed there by two members of Synanon named Lance Kenton and Joe Musico at Charles' request. So again, this is also another thing too that was a little bit unclear of whether Charles directly ordered these two people to carry out this act of violence on his behalf, or if he instead kind of riled them up and they became angry enough to do it. So, you know, you could say that he was just sitting on that little radio system, talking shit about Paul Morantz for months on end and it kind of riled up his base to want to do something against him on their own accord.

Katie: Did Paul know about the radio station? Did somebody tell him because why would he automatically just assume that that snake was from Synanon. There had to be a reason. So like, did he know about any of that stuff or he just knew just how they, because of how they held that woman and...

AJ: Yeah. Well, he knew, like he knew that, I don't know if he knew exactly about the radio system. I feel like that's something that you would only know if you were like on the inside. Maybe Francis told him after she got out, if she kind of experienced that while she was there or something, but I think he just knew how sort of aggressive they were and how I think, I don't know. He figured it wasn't just a random attack, I guess. Like it had to be a very orchestrated thing. I don't know if I would think that. I would just assume that the snake just got in there on its own accord. Like, I wouldn't just assume it was like a targeted thing, but I don't think he knew about the radio stuff at that time. I mean, again, I, I never said like one way or the other, but I feel like he just kind of got the vibe that this was a group that you don't want to mess with. And it happened around, like, this would have been the same year, like later that same year when all that stuff happened. So I feel like also proximity to like, he's like, what are the chances that this would be another person targeting me other than this group that I've been trying to sue for a lot of money? Yeah. So, so like I said it was a little bit unclear whether, what sort of directives Charles was giving his followers or whether he was sort of just heavily hinting or riling up his, his base to, to commit these, these acts. Like, we don't really know those details. Former Synanon attorney Phillip Burdette claims that it was the latter. So he claims that Charles was just riling up his base and that they were doing all of these acts on their own accord and that they weren't necessarily directly linked to Charles, even though he was the one sort of like he would plant the seeds of hate and motivate his followers to hate the enemies of the religion. Then they would then concoct these plans to commit acts of violence, to protect the organization. Three court declarations from 1983, and these were given in exchange for immunity, so I guess some people who are within the organization later said that we will give you information if we have immunity. But they said that Charle's assistant Walter Lou Bell approved hit lists of such enemies that were created by Imperial Marines, which were, I guess like, cause they ended up eventually at the height of Synanon and they had like a whole like sort of military system and they had access to a lot of arsenal and guns. So the Imperial Marines were kind of like the name of the military group within Synanon. So it was these people who came forward that said that it was Charles' assistants who would approve the hit lists of all these enemies that the Imperial Marines would compile and they also claim that the security chief of the organization wanted Joe Musico to hire a hitman to take care of Morantz but that the cost was like $10,000 and it was too high. So then Joe and Lance were ordered just to do the act themselves. So that's kind of what came out. So whether that came directly from Charles, again, we don't know whether it was his assistant or the security chief or something. But I feel like they all kind of thought that they were going along with what Charles would want or, you know, going along with the way of the way of the religion and the way of the church. So I think that they thought they were doing a good thing. In one quote by Charles from LA magazine he said, "Most of what Synanon did in 1977, at least what I knew about I approved of because as I pointed out before over and over again, I'm one hell of a good executive and not too much of what went on in the organization that I ran that I didn't approve of. I don't know everything that went on, of course." So that's what he later said, but I feel like I don't really believe anything he ever says. So whether who really knows? So Lance and Joe, so these were the two men that put the snake into the mailbox, so they were eventually, they eventually pled no contest to attempted murder because Paul Morantz survived the attack. So they pled no contest and they were only sentenced to one year in LA County jail and three years of probation as a result. And since this attack, Paul actually contracted long-term illnesses that were related, or he thinks related to the venom. So he has neuropathy, arthritis and a blood disease that he thinks may be as a result of this snake bite attack. And as a result of this, he is required to receive blood transfusions every other week. So ever since the late 70's he's had to go for blood transfusions every other week, which is pretty sad. So only a short time after this on May 19th, 1982, the IRS revoked Synanon's tax exempt status and the organization was eventually ordered to pay 17 million dollars in back taxes from all of the years where they had tax exempt status at like accrued to about 17 million that they were ordered to then pay back. And then of course they couldn't afford this, therefore they went bankrupt and the organization and cult was officially shut down and disbanded in 1991. So as for Dederich himself, LA Magazine says that he pled no contest for a conspiracy to commit murder charge in 1980. And he was only fined $10,000 and sentenced to five years of probation and barred from having any affiliation with Synanon. So that was the only punishment he received. It says in the documentary that Paul Morantz agreed to let Charles avoid jail time because at the time I think Paul, I don't know, it seems kind of weird because it kind of gives the vibe from the documentary that Paul was just in such poor health at this time, because this would have only been right after the attack, he was in such poor health that like, he couldn't be bothered to fight it anymore. He kind of just gave up, he's like, I'll let him, I guess he was the prosecutor, he was the one suing them. So he was just like, you know, I'll let them avoid jail time if he just has no association with Synanon ever again, and we'll give him the $10,000 fine and the five years of probation. So for all of this, Dederich really never did see any real jail time or any real punishment at all. So after his conviction, Charles and his wife at that time, Jenny moved into a mobile home in Visalia and he died in 1997, just a few weeks before his 84th birthday. So he died in 97. So that would've only been six years after Synanon kind of disbanded. So he didn't survive much longer than Synanon itself.

Katie: So, Synanon died with him basically, right? There's no Synanon now?

AJ: Yeah. There's no Synanon or at least that we know of or anyone knows of. It pretty much died with him, so it wasn't one of those ones where like the main leader dies and then there's like someone to succeed him and take it over. It's like it died when he died, because by the time he died, it was disbanded anyway, and it fell apart pretty quickly. I think that was the tax exempt status, which that's a huge thing because once they were, that was revoked, they had all these millions of dollars to pay back in back taxes and they just couldn't afford it. And that's pretty much what made them bankrupt and put them under which so I don't know if they hadn't have revoked that, I don't know if they would have even like, they could have still been a thing today because if you're not paying taxes and other stuff, you could just get all that money and all that wealth and then you don't obviously easy to continue things going on when you're not having to pay taxes, like huge amounts of taxes. So...

Katie: It started out as such a good thing and like a good idea and it was actually helping people. It sucks that it, like every cult goes down this bad road, like, why can't you just continue on and do things properly? It feels like power gets to people's heads so fast and like the promise of money just corrupts them so quickly. It's crazy.

AJ: I know. And he probably saw like, he, he started to see you know, I can get all these people thinking they can work at other jobs inside the compound, and then they bring all their money back to me. And then he amasses all this wealth through like his assets with like all these buildings and all this stuff, like donations that are coming in like millions and millions of dollars. So, and then that's going to egg him on to continue it even more because he's getting richer and richer and richer and people are letting him do it right? Because he's this powerful kind of being that everyone kind of looks up to and he makes them all shave their heads and I guess the shaved heads thing was sort of like a ritual that that was one of the first things that they would do. There's someone in the documentary, Selena Whitman. They interview her in that episode of "Deadly Cults" and she and her mother were a part of the cult for a short amount of time, but they had, their heads shaved right away, like as soon as they got there, basically. So it was kind of one of the first like cleansing ritual sort of thing is how it was seen. So that's why everyone who was there had a shaved head, and they all wore overalls and they all had big smiles on their faces.

Stephanie: So what happened to those people who like went to the cult in the first place to get help with their addictions and mental health? Did they continue to stay with it or did they end up finding other resources?

AJ: Well, I think, I mean, I think at the beginning, like the people who were initially were there, maybe they got, maybe it did help them. Like I can't sit here and say that it helped nobody at all. Like when it started out as the drug treatment program I mean, he didn't really have any professional training or I don't know how like professional his staff was or any of that kind of stuff. But they did have like a lot ,also too one of the things that they had was like a huge, they would have a lot of like group public therapy, therapy sessions. So like everyone would have to like sit in a circle and talk about like these like deep dark secrets and stuff. So that's also a thing that we see a lot of times, it's like stripping them down and getting them really vulnerable. But that also occurred in this, in this cult too but so I can't sit here and say that it didn't help any of those people, but eventually it was just all people, because like I said, those squares who didn't even have an addiction, they just wanted to be a part of the movement. So eventually it was probably all made up of people who didn't even have addiction at all, they were just there because they wanted to, wanted to see him up close and they want it to be a part of this huge movement of this new brand new society. I guess it was weird.

Stephanie: Cults are weird. But fascinating at the same time.

Katie: They're so interesting.

AJ: I know. I just feel like it's just so weird how, like somebody could just have that much power over someone and that they were just give up all autonomy and just do whatever someone said. Like, it's just weird to me how somebody can just go from being like, not in that situation to, in that situation in such a short period of time, and literally following this guy, Charles Dederich who whatever he's saying, he's no he's nothing special. So it's just weird that like, somebody has just like the charisma and the money, like the power to manipulate somebody, to be able to convince them to do stuff when they're not even like, who is he? He's just some shmuck who like, had nothing else going for him and decided to start this. I don't know.

Katie: I know he had a good idea and then it just, he got a power trip super fast. So he's nothing special.

AJ: Yeah. I guess that's all it takes sometimes to. Like I said, we did see a lot of the themes that we see in all the cults that we're going to talk about and every cult that exists, I'm sure. But I just also took to, it's interesting that that's a big thing about Scientology is that they still have tax exempt status, which in order to get tax exempt status, you have to declare yourself as a religion. And if you're a religion, then you don't have to pay taxes, but that's a whole other thing, but I know one of the things about Scientology is that they say in order to get tax exempt status they say that they are a religion, but to the public, they say, no, you can supplement your religion with it. Like you can be a Christian and be a Scientologist, or you could be, you know, Buddhist and be a Scientologist. It's just kind of supplementary. But in order to get tax exempt status, you have to believe in one thing, like you have to be a collective sort of religion. So it's like, are they lying to the IRS or are they lying to the public? One or the other, but I wonder if that was also happening in, in this case as well.

Katie: They're lying to themselves.

Stephanie: Well, pretty soon somebody's going to find out about that and then really question their religious status.

Katie: Well, I feel like people already know about it. There's no way the government doesn't know what they are, you know? And so, I mean, celebrities are in it. Many people, there've been documentaries, some celebrities have come forward so it's just, I feel like it's just too powerful at this point, too much money in it that they can't do anything. Or they won't do anything.

AJ: But it's so it's so crazy. Like how is Tom cruise so powerful. Like, we can't do anything to it's just so weird. I don't know.

Katie: Yeah. And a lot of money goes into the group. Like it's like celebrities put a lot of their own money into it, like that kind of thing. So, yeah. And there's probably like different levels, right? Like Tom cruise is probably like top level and it's like the more money you put in the higher level you get up to. So yeah.

AJ: Anyone else have any final thoughts of Synanon before we wrap it up or was it what you thought was it?

Stephanie: I feel like it was just like a, it's a good thing and then just went too far the other way.

Katie: Yeah. I think probably the most shocking thing is like the abortions where it's one thing to suggest that it's another thing for women to actually go through with that. So that's, I think is the most shocking part about it. And it's just kind of really sad that I'm sure a lot of them didn't want to do it at the time or they thought they did, and then they regret it completely afterwards. So it's kind of an extreme thing.

AJ: Well, that was the thing. Yeah, that's true. It's like, you can't really get that from the articles of the documentary about like, whether they were like strapping these women to the beds while they're doing the abortions, or if it was like, at the time they went in there kind of willingly, even though they were just brainwashed into doing it. You know what I mean? So it's not really consent. It's just kind of like they're being told to do it. So they do it.

Katie: Yeah. When the episode that I watched, it was kind of like, that was the new thing. The new rule was, you're not allowed to have, bring any more kids into the cult. So, you know, if you want to continue to be here, then that's what you have to do. And so a lot of them just figured that that's what they had to do. So they will like "willingly", I say that in air quotes did it because they thought it was fair for the greater good, I guess. But yeah.

Stephanie: It's like the total opposite though, because a lot of, I'd say maybe 90% of cults out there, they want you to have as many children because they want more members and people to continue on their legacy. So it's just that. Yeah, that was shocking to see, like he didn't want anybody having children or bringing children into the cult.

Katie: Yeah. That's why I feel like it was very shortsighted and it wasn't really like this religion where people believe in a greater power. It was very much like I want this now, this money now, kids are going to disrupt that. They're not going to, you know, have any purpose for me in the, you know, in the near future. Cause I'm going to be dead by the time they're able to do anything. So yeah, it was very, very selfish.

AJ: Yeah. Absolute power corrupts. Absolutely. It's basic. It's a basic message of this episode and all episodes about cults.

Yeah. So that about does it for this, this week's episode. So next week we're going to be doing part three of our mini series and Katie's is going to be telling us about the cult that she's been researching. So we're excited to hear that. But in the meantime, you can follow us on all the social medias. We are on Instagram@ crimefamilypodcast. We are on Twitter @crimefamilypod1, and we are on Facebook @ Crime Family Podcast, and you can definitely follow us on the social medias because that's where we are posting you know, any case updates and stuff that come up. Like we will do an update episode towards the end of the season. But if you want to get the updates in real time, as they happen, we will be posting that on our social medias. So definitely follow us there. You can also go to our, our new website, it's www.crimefamilypodcast.ca. And you can check out all of our episodes there. You can listen to the episodes right on the website and there's transcripts and everything like that. And yeah, we're very excited to have our website up and running and we want you to follow us on all the social medias to keep in touch with us, let us know your feedback and your tips and your reviews and all that good stuff. So thank you very much. And until next time. Bye.

Katie: Bye.